Podcast: Minister Caroline Dinenage talks about her encounter with the Krays and social care reform

Just days after care minister Caroline Dinenage talked to carehome.co.uk about her husband's death threats and social care reform for its podcast Let's Talk About Care, she was replaced by Helen Whately in Boris Johnson's cabinet reshuffle.

Caroline Dinenage has been appointed Minister of State in the Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport (DCMS), effectively swapping departments with Ms Whately, who has worked as Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Arts, Heritage and Tourism since September.

In the days before her replacement, Caroline Dinenage, MP for Gosport, spoke out about government thinking on social care reform and said she was unable to promise that a social care plan will arrive by this Summer.

Speaking as a guest on the 'Let's Talk About Care' podcast, the minister revealed the government had not ruled out a lifetime cap on care costs and free personal care in a social care plan that Boris Johnson promised would be published this year.

During the podcast, Caroline Dinenage said she had been "working very closely with the immigration minister" and "making the case for” lowering the minimum annual salary threshold for non-British skilled workers further than the current £30,000.

A report by the Migration Advisory Committee (MAC), recommended the government reduce the salary threshold for skilled workers taking a job in Britain, after the UK leaves the European Union, to £25,600 a year.

But social care leaders are concerned that Britain will not be able to afford desperately needed care workers from the EU after Brexit because the MAC recommendation to lower the salary threshold fails to go far enough. On average, care workers are paid less than £20,000 a year.

A new point-based immigration system, set to come into force in January 2021, will aim to end visas for low-skilled workers. It will award points to applicants based on specific skills, qualifications, salaries, their ability to speak English and profession.

Caroline Dinenage told carehome.co.uk: "The beauty of an immigration system that's based on points is that if you've got a skills shortage in an area, you can increase the points for that particular skill."

Budget: 'It's easy to just say 1.5 billion'

Local authorities have seen their social care budgets cut repeatedly over the last five years, with the Local Government Association estimating that social care faces a funding gap of £4.3 billion.

However, Caroline Dinenage defended the government's funding record saying it has already committed £1.5 billion for social care for 2020/21.

When asked if she would follow the House of Lords Economic Affairs select committee recommendation to give £8 billion a year for social care in the budget, Ms Dinenage said: “It’s easy to just say £1.5 billion, £2.5 billion, here’s another billion. Just the word ‘billion’.

“Think of the vast sums of money here. The fact that you can just keep chucking a billion pound here, a billion pound there at a system and people are still saying 'oh we need more, we need more, we need more'.”

'I now have a panic button by my front door'

She also opened up on the podcast about death threats, revealing her husband, the former MP Mark Lancaster "had a number of death threats to the extent one of them was written in red paint on a war memorial.

"The police had to come and do an audit of my home. I now have a panic button by my front door and one by my bed.

“It’s very difficult when you’ve got two MPs in a family and one represents a seat in Milton Keynes and one represents a seat in Gosport. The children are all in Hampshire. It was really to support me that he took the decision to stand down.”

Ronnie and Reggie Kray

While she is used to working with famous figures such as Prime Minister Boris Johnson, Caroline Dinenage also had encounters with the infamous East End gangsters known as the Kray twins.

Her father, the television broadcaster Fred Dinenage, was writing a biography about the Kray twins and she remembers answering the phone to either Ronnie or Reggie Kray.

Ms Dinenage said: “Often I would answer the phone and there would be a strong London accent on the phone asking for my dad. I didn’t really, I suppose, at the time, I was in my teens, understand why he was so notorious”.

‘Misleading’

At the end of last year, the charity Age UK brought out statistics saying one in seven people, equivalent to 1.5m people have some degree of unmet care needs.

The minister was asked about this on the podcast but she responded calling the statistic "misleading".

Ms Dinenage said: “There are people in that group who are getting the care they need but they’re self funding. It’s not people that are left bereft and without care."

However in response to Ms Dinenage's comment, Dr Libby Webb, senior research manager at Age UK said: "The minister is incorrect. £1.5 million people is the number of people in England aged 65 or over with an unmet care need regardless of whether they are self-funded.

"They are having difficulty with activities of daily living and their needs are not being met. We welcome engagement with the minister so that she can understand our statistics better.”

'The toughest & yet the best of jobs'

Commenting on news of her departure from her post in the Department for Health and Social Care, Caroline Dinenage tweeted to Helen Whately:

Many congratulations- It’s a job I’ve loved doing for 2 years and an incredible team. I’m so pleased to hand the baton into such safe hands x https://t.co/ccKUC4MHbZ

— Caroline Dinenage (@cj_dinenage) February 13, 2020

After 2 amazing years at @DHSCgovuk I’m off to face big new challenges at @DCMS Huge thanks to all the inspiring, incredible people it’s been an honour to meet & work with along the way. The toughest & yet the best of jobs. Excited for the journey ahead but will miss you all ??

— Caroline Dinenage (@cj_dinenage) February 13, 2020

Helen Whately has been the MP for Faversham and Mid Kent since 2015. Aged 43, she was born in Norwich and grew up near Redhill in Surrey.

Ms Whately said in her maiden speech as MP that it was work experience in hospitals, that motivated her to pursue a career in to improve healthcare as a whole rather than following in her parents' footsteps who are both doctors.

She studied Philosophy, Politics and Economics (PPE) at Oxford. She was a member of debating society, the Oxford Union, but she did not have any interest in student politics, saying that she felt that it "did not seem to be about getting stuff done".

After university, she worked at PricewaterhouseCoopers for two years as a management consultant trainee before working at AOL.

After working as a media policy advisor for a former Shadow Secretary of State for Culture, Media and Sport, Hugo Swire, she said this experience inspired her to pursue a political career.

In 2008, British society magazine Tatler selected Ms Whately as one of ten young, rising stars of the Conservative Party and tipped her as a future Health Secretary.

Taking to Twitter to speak about her new job as care minister, Helen Whately said:

Completely delighted to be appointed Minister of State in the Department of Health and Social Care. Looking forward to working with Secretary of State @MattHancock and all the brilliant people in @DHSCgovuk & the #NHS & #SocialCare. Can’t wait to get going.

— Helen Whately (@Helen_Whately) February 13, 2020

To listen to Caroline Dinenage speaking as a guest on 'Let's talk about care' podcast click here